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The following discussion is an archived debate of the case of suspected sockpuppetry. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page. All edits should go to the talk page of this case. If you are seeing this page as a result of an attempt to open a new case of sockpuppetry of the same user, read this for detailed instructions.

User:Atabek

[edit]
Suspected sockpuppeteer

Atabek (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)

Suspected sockpuppets

Earthdream (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)
Drastamat (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)
Shantinorashkar (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)
Zipirtich (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)
128.195.31.152 (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)
Dondurma (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)
Hachiktoumanyan (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)


Report submission by

--VartanM 00:03, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Evidence

Earthdream reverting to previous version of articles edited by Atabek [1] [2] He is know to use suckpuppets before [[3]] By mistake he made an annon. edit with his IP address(128.195.31.152), which he corrected very fast. see [4]


Compare edit made by Atabek[5] with edits made by User:Zipirtich[6], User:Earthdream[7], and User:Drastamat[8]. -- Augustgrahl 01:23, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

Atabek is placed on standard revert parole for one year. He is limited to one revert per page per week, excepting obvious vandalism. Further, he is required to discuss any content reversions on the page's talk page. [[9]]

  • This is preposterous. Both users Augustgrahl and Vartanm are involved in potraying convicted terrorists at Varoujan Garabedian and Monte Melkonian as "freedom fighters" and constantly removing evidence to State Department reports. When they fail to get their point through, they find some Drastamat (very likely established by themselves or banned users Artaxiad or Fadix) and accuse me of having socks. I don't need socks as I openly discuss all my edits on talk pages and make the edits. I think after ArbCom it's pretty clear that these people are driven by nothing else but by national sentiment and self-convincing libel. Why don't you confront the evidence and discuss your edits, before resorting into this style of harassment and attacks. Atabek 15:59, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
    • It was suspected that you were using socks, because these accounts were used to make edits identical to ones that you made. I never ruled out the possibility that it was an impostor. It is ridiculous to accuse me of using these accounts (why would I want to draw my fellow editor User:MarshallBagramyan into an edit war that resulted in him being blocked for 24 hours?), and I never sought to justify terrorism. What you have just said can be taken as both a personal attack and an attempt to make this a battle along national lines, so please desist in making such comments. -- Augustgrahl 16:07, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
      • Augustgrahl, if you're not driven by the national sentiment, I don't see why MarshallBagramyan is your "fellow" editor. After all, Wikipedia is encyclopedic environment, and there should be no "fellow" editors on national basis. So please, desist yourself in accusing me of "battle along national lines" and learn to discuss and come to consensus on talk pages. Just like you accuse me of sockpuppetry, you could very well be the establisher of that same Drastamat sockpuppet in order to blackmail me. Can you prove otherwise, besides claiming Bagramyan as "fellow" editor or groundlessly accusing me of personal attack. Atabek 16:46, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Their both from WikiProject Armenia. Making them fellow editors. We suspected that it was you because of his editing pattern. If you suspect that it was one of us your more then welcome to use checkuser. VartanM 17:01, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
    • Yes, thanks for confirming that it's a "battle along national lines" for yourselves. I don't claim Drastamat is any of you in particular, although if the checkuser should not exclude that possibility either. I am just asking for the logic of Augustgrahl or yourself, both of which are involved in editing disputes, in accusing me and resorting to such low-grade techniques as blackmailing me without evidence. Atabek 17:11, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
User:MarshallBagramyan is my fellow editor because we are both part of a collaborative project on Wikipedia to improve the information available on topics relating to Armenia. This doesn't require any nationalist sentiment, just an interest in the subject, which is evident given that there are several Wikiproject Armenia members who are not of Armenian descent. Saying that I am driven by nationalist sentiment is both an assumption of bad faith and a personal attack, so please stop - these kinds of accusations are not constructive and only serve to increase hostility between editors. I know that I am not the creator of the sockpuppets, and you can run as many checkuser searches on me as you desire, because nothing will connect me to any of the socks. Now, I never definitely said that the socks were created by you, just that you were a likely suspect, given that the edits were made on pages you had previously edited, using the same exact edits as you had. If that isn't evidence of a connection, I don't know what is. -- Augustgrahl 17:14, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
If you claim to be here "to improve articles relating to Armenia", that should be your primary task, instead of accusing people along "national lines" without evidence. As you have been explained quite clearly, the suspected sockpuppet could be of Azeri origin or of Armenian origin trying to get another Azeri/Turk banned. If you don't know which case it is, then your targetting of myself or any other single user of certain non-Armenian origin is simply driven by the "national sentiment"! Next time, please, think carefully before taking sides in a rush, and this time, please, learn to apologize for your groundless accusation and mistake, just like your fellow Vartan did below. Atabek 22:11, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I never said that the puppet-master couldn't have been an Armenian, or a Russian, or a martian, or anything. I didn't target you because you're an Azeri, I suspected you were the creator of the sock puppets because they were used to make edits identical to your's. I don't see anything faulty or nationalistic about that logic. Note that suspected is different from declaring for certain, and a checkuser confirmed that you weren't responsible. Please stop assuming bad faith on my part - it might be useful for you to read over this policy: WP:AGF. This is not about "sides" and ethnicity, but discovering who is responsible for disruptive editing. -- Augustgrahl 22:50, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It could be another user, or it could be banned user AdilBaguirov.Azerbaijani 14:32, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The same way you and Grandmaster showed up on Dacy's parole violation report, and remember Atabek, your own false accusations on check user. And besides, Adil Baguirov has come into Wikipedia before with several socks, so my comment was completely acceptable and justified, because as pointed out, new users dont suddenly start edit warring on hot issues unless they are socks or they are being used as meat puppets. Besides, why would anyone every suspect Atabek of having a sock, oh wait, maybe its because you had one before: User:Tengri.Azerbaijani 01:03, 17 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusions

Checkuser results were negative. I would like to apologize to Atabek for accusing him of using socks. Can somebody close this, before it gets out of hand. check user results can be found here [11] VartanM 19:06, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, apology accepted. I hope we move on to constructively edit the articles. Atabek 22:11, 16 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
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